Curse

Pyrea · Jul 25, 2007, 12:59 PM // 12:59

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what others think, only what you think. If you have fun playing GW or doing anything else, what right does anyone else have to tell you it's a waste of time.

I myself am 34 years old and have a strong addiction to GW. My typical week goes like this: Monday to Friday I work during the day and play for 6hrs a day on weekdays, then all day on Saturday and Sunday. I don't have a family (ie not married with kids) and have a few close friends who I see occassionally. At the end of the day though, I ENJOY GW.

People may say that I'm wasting my years away, but then what else would I be doing if I didn't have an interest in GW. Most people my age have a family or go out to pubs and clubs to meet people etc. I would rather adventure in this imaginary world

glountz · Jul 25, 2007, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawnmower

The follow up question to this, is if course: Is it more educational to play guildwars than to watch an episode of say... prison break or the office or something?

Video games hurt when:
- You have tons of homework to do but you're playing GW.
- You have friends/family to meet but you're playing GW
- You have work to finish but you're playing GW.
- You should go out and do some sport to seduce that girl you saw yesterday but you prefer virtual ele chicks in GW.
- You have to eat or to sleep to be healthy tomorrow but you prefer to finish that quest in GW.
You have to remind that video games, as well as TV, are completely selfcentered. You don't share anything with friends/family. You can't compare mastering an instrument/cooking to be good at killing DoA mobs. You can cook or play for people, you can't play GW for them.
That's why videogames or watching TV are not socially accepted, this just that there is nothing social in it. And don't start about online players, they don't know you, you will never meet them, you can scam/insult them without any repercussion and they can too. That's nothing social.
When you go in MMORPGs, you are leaving from the real world. You enjoy playing alone.
Cooking your best green pepper steak will please all the people gathered around your table, not only you. When you're playing, people only see your back. And, generally, your back is not interesting.
As long as you play GW only in your lon lost hours, there is no problem. But if you begin to skip friends/family/work/things to do for GW, then you begin to loose your life.
Some video games like the wii ones, highly social, are not exactly the same.

tyche7 · Jul 25, 2007, 01:28 PM // 13:28

There are actual psychological studies that have proven video games are better for you than television. There are many advantages to playing video games you don't even think about but watching tv is completely passive.

As for me -- I do both at the same time (-;

LOLERCAUST · Jul 25, 2007, 01:53 PM // 13:53

it is a waste of time, i use to be the one who would play for the whole day straight and then some...it was really fun all my friends on, doing 2 man uw pwning axxtes for hours but then after that nerf with the aoe all my friends stopped playing and the game got really boring and i stopped playing now i look back at how much time i've wasted (3,500 hours over 2 years) now im hooked on something much better and healthier bodybuiding..

notskorn · Jul 25, 2007, 02:00 PM // 14:00

It doesn't matter if its a waste of time. If video games can help you relax after your day at work/school then what does it matter? Its the same as television or any other kind of hobby in that respect.

Tijger · Jul 25, 2007, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOLERCAUST

it is a waste of time, i use to be the one who would play for the whole day straight and then some...it was really fun all my friends on, doing 2 man uw pwning axxtes for hours but then after that nerf with the aoe all my friends stopped playing and the game got really boring and i stopped playing now i look back at how much time i've wasted (3,500 hours over 2 years) now im hooked on something much better and healthier bodybuiding..

Sounds to me like you just replaced one addiction with another and think thats somehow healthier or better.

Gaming is the same as any other pastime (the word implies it already), its there to pass the time, a diversion, just like books, TV and anything else.
Addictive personalities can be addicted to anything but gaming is no worse or better then anything else.

2 hours a day is not an issue, someone who works, enjoys playing his games and is otherwise behaving normally is fine and healthy imho, he doesnt need to stop or change his lifestyle.

Sophitia Leafblade · Jul 25, 2007, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

You have to remind that video games, as well as TV, are completely selfcentered. You don't share anything with friends/family. You can't compare mastering an instrument/cooking to be good at killing DoA mobs. You can cook or play for people, you can't play GW for them.
That's why videogames or watching TV are not socially accepted, this just that there is nothing social in it. And don't start about online players, they don't know you, you will never meet them, you can scam/insult them without any repercussion and they can too. That's nothing social.
When you go in MMORPGs, you are leaving from the real world. You enjoy playing alone.
Cooking your best green pepper steak will please all the people gathered around your table, not only you. When you're playing, people only see your back. And, generally, your back is not interesting.
As long as you play GW only in your lon lost hours, there is no problem. But if you begin to skip friends/family/work/things to do for GW, then you begin to loose your life.
Some video games like the wii ones, highly social, are not exactly the same.

I beg to differ. Gw is a Social Game, ive made several friends from it. The main reason i got GW to begin with was myself and a couple of RL friends decided we wanted a Game we could all play together and Gw was a game we all thought looked amazing so we all got it to play together which we did. Rather than meeting up at the local Pub for a drink, we all gather on GW instead, where we can talk, have fun and relax all at the same time, without having to spend anymore (other than the original cost of the game). We talk about in game and out of games things, which would be much harder without Gw since they now live several 100 miles away.

I dont deny its stll good to meet up in the real world especially for people not on the game such as family or other friends, but that doesnt make it any less social, Its no different that going over the friends house after work each day and not seeing ur family/other friends because u are out.

As for not playing Gw for people actually u can, either u can do missions they find difficult etc. or u can use there log in details to do things for them (with there permission ofc)

Sure u get Scammers and Anti social people in Gw but thats no different than the outside world. I can think of numerious types of people you can pass by on the street who can call u names, try to scam you or generally be an annoyance.

the_jos · Jul 25, 2007, 04:22 PM // 16:22

Quote:

You will also most likely start to think that most people in the world are immature

Your first paragraph is correct in my case. I feel exactly that way about other people my age(or younger). But im not sure if that cause, is what you describe. I just dont like other people my age because almost all of them I have met are shallow people who just can't relax. Who need to drink to have fun. who would rather dance on a disco to techno music and look like an idiot chicken that is having a seizure, instead of sitting on a restaurant or a cafee like a regular non-uptight adult who dont have to be something they are not.

I like +25 aged people much better. They seem more real and more down to earth to me. Im incredible shy around people my own age, and I feel a combination more maturity compared to them, and a feel of inferiority because I cant make myself go out there and just drink my brains out like any other "normal 20 year old".

Well, I have to comment on that.
If you feel more comfortable with +25 aged people, try to find out how and where they socialize and try to get between them.

Sure you don't need to do anything the average person of your age does, but real-life social interaction is important.
Others already said that and I can only repeat that.
If it can't be with people of your own age, try finding people that fit better, even if they are older.

I never felt like someone my age, even now (more than 10 years older then you are), while I don't consider other immature of myself more mature anymore. We just have different interests and life experiences, meaning they will never fully understand me and I will never fully understand them.

The reason that I am telling this is that we have someone younger than you in our guild that is having similar problems and I think more young people are having problems with these kinds of things.
Playing games is a very easy way to avoid real-life problems.
We talked things over late at night and there are some problems that are causing his gaming behaviour.
Most have to do with not feeling comfortable with himself because of various reasons which has mostly to do with growing up.
The people online gave various surgestions that could help him, most of us have been young at some point in our life.
Some people grow up faster than others.

My own situation is slightly different.
I have a social disorder since very early childhood. This has been confirmed recently. Combined with an above average IQ I was able to excel in certain areas and by that hide my problems for a long time.
I also know exactly what behaviour is social accepted and how to work with that. It is however not 'normal behaviour' for me and requires constant attention. I also can get very uncomfortable in certain 'normal' social situations, close to mental shutdown or panic-attack.

The real question here is are you more like my guildie or more like me.
If you are more like him, try getting outside more and find people you do feel comfortable with, even if they are 10 years older.
If you are more like me, I'd surgest you get some kind of professional help.
You will hit walls and you will hit them hard.

Healers Wisper · Jul 25, 2007, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Here is how I think about this. I am married and have a 7 month old son. I play anwhere from 2-3 hours a day, usually Mon-Fri. Weekends vary as I am often busy and have other things to do. Now I have been approached by people witha similar attitude as the OP.

My take is simple. I play after work at night before bed, after my son is asleep usually, if he is awake I rarely play with people because if I need to I get up and take care of him. I dont like TV, new sitcomes and reality TV are boring and kinda suck, so instead I play my game cause I find it entertaining and fun. At the end of my day, I want to relax as all people do. SOme take a book, some take posting board, other like TV, and its obvious here we like a game. So what.

The line falls here. I have a job. I do well at my job. I am finishing my masters, love my son and wife and spend time with them everyday. I get enough sleep to function in daily tasks and I play my game. If GW was to ever damage those criticle things in Life (family, work, sleep) then I have crossed the line, until then I dont see a problem with it

Dodgers777 · Jul 25, 2007, 06:20 PM // 18:20

I wish I was still in college so I can "waste my life" for 6 hrs a day. Damn this job for getting in the way of my playing GW. I'm almost broke since I haven't been farming...

Darksun · Jul 25, 2007, 06:49 PM // 18:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Personette

I don't think the TV excuse holds much water. It's like, "Well, if I wasn't doing THIS worthless thing, I'd be doing this OTHER worthless thing, so it's six of one half dozen of the other."

It does if you are doing it less. The average US male watches 4 hours of tv a day. If he plays for 2 that's hardly worse.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Personette

I try to end every day like, "Well, what did I do right today, what did I do wrong today?" If I can say something like, "Well, I got a good hour and a half of (serious, non-fiction) reading in between the subway and my lunch hour, and I went to the gym, and I was reasonably productive at work," - that's fine for the average day and if I played a bit of GW in the time that was leftover, even if I could have been using that time better I know I'm mostly in the black where spending my time usefully is concerned. I like to make sure that I spend more evenings in a given week going out - to dinners or parties or whatever - than I do loafing around at home.

The idea that going out to parties is somehow more productive than playing games with friends at home is a joke. Unless someone has some spiritual reason, There is no way to determine if wasting time gaming is any better than wasting time being Mr Universe. The whole going to the gym thing is a joke. It's like peoples "look i'm responsible" card. I was going to the gym for quite a while, most people aren't really developing themselves. They could do as much good if they just watched their diet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Personette

I don't understand people who use GW for really essential social interactions; you just can't build up the level of trust and interdependence that defines true friendship. I don't see adventuring online as a suitable substitute for real adventure, or pseudo-battles as equivalents for real trauma. If you aren't having real adventures, and real problems, go find some. That's what makes people interesting, and interesting people are better at keeping themselves entertained. I don't understand people who play when they're bored; why do anything you think is boring? There are so many interesting things to do.

Because your assumption that " There are so many interesting things to do" is just that. An assumption. Some people don't enjoy those things. Besides somethings that people like take longer. I draw, paint & 3D model, it takes a long time.
As for "real adventures". Oh please. Unless you are battling aliens in a trap laden Aztec jungle, who cares? So you biked across the US. so? If you enjoyed it, great! But I don't know that that makes someone a better person. You work at a homeless shelter? ok, I can respect that. I think some of the anti-game sentiment come more from how well you take social acceptance/rejection. And how popular you need to feel.

2 hours is fine unless you somehow have no time. As long as you don't neglect people, your health or chores, you should be fine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

That's why videogames or watching TV are not socially accepted, this just that there is nothing social in it.

This is very much NOT true. Watching tv is VERY socially acceptable.. how many restaurants have tvs? how many people talk about shows they saw? people watch a LOT of tv.

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

When you go in MMORPGs, you are leaving from the real world. You enjoy playing alone.
Cooking your best green pepper steak will please all the people gathered around your table, not only you. When you're playing, people only see your back. And, generally, your back is not interesting.

Well, while I agree it is good to know how to cook regardless, I enjoy playing with my friend in my room on my network, than alone. You can play with lots of people on a LAN. it's way more fun.

Andisa Kalorn · Jul 25, 2007, 07:19 PM // 19:19

"Productivity" is overrated.

IMO, education is a huge waste of time. Much of what you are taught is completely irrelevant to what you want to do in life, much is just fluff extending the amount of time that you have to stay in school/university, and you will forget the vast majority of what you are taught. Yes, it helps you get a job and make you a more informed citizen (and feeds you nationalist propaganda), but what they need to teach you could be done in a much shorter time.

Working really hard to make a lot of money is also a waste of time. Beyond having enough money to get what you need, all that extra money doesn't make you any happier, even though that's exactly what people think it will do. I'd rather just spend my time doing something that makes me happy (playing a game) than work a lot of overtime trying to get something that I think will make me happy but really won't.

We are quite lucky to have this amount of free time in the first place. In the past, people would spend the whole day at work on farms or in factories, often in horrible conditions. They were productive. But I'd never want to trade places with them.

Life is short. Try to spend some of your time relaxing and having fun, not conforming to society's standards of what is considered fun or productive. People will say you're wasting your life by playing games instead of going out and getting drunk, because they're too narrow-minded to understand that what is fun for them may not be fun for others.

Anyway, I played a lot of GW while I was doing my degree. Probably more than 2 hours a day. And I did just fine (got many scholarships, even). So as long as your life is in order in terms of family, friends, school/job - then do whatever you want to do in your spare time.

Perynne · Jul 25, 2007, 07:55 PM // 19:55

I think that playing games is just as good a hobby as anything else. There's also tons of people who make a living out of it, and create wonderful works of interactive art. Games are probably even better than watching TV, since TV isn't as interactive and you don't have a chance to correspond with other people. Just like with other things, as long as it doesn't become an obsession, you're fine. 2 hours a day is not bad at all.

Your brother is just worried about you. I have to agree that it doesn't sound healthy living in someone else's basement and never meeting any other people at all. I can understand having problems with being social but sometimes all it takes is finding a couple of like-minded people to get your social life cheered up.
For example, I have panic attacks occasionally and generally dislike going to parties and hanging out with people whose only idea of good pastime is getting totally wasted on alcohol. Still, when I'm with friends (about 90% of whom I've met online - that includes my boyfriend) occasional drinking and partying is very much fun since we do it our own way. They enjoy the same things as I do (anime, games, music...) and we have tons of fun times together doing things we are interested in. It's socializing, even if most of the time we do rather geeky stuff together that "normal" people don't understand.

It always takes a while to fully become relaxed with a group of friends, but it's always worth it in the end.

Join a local anime club, look for friends from your area in forums, see if there's anyone on IRC that lives nearby. They're all good places to find people who share your interests. If you're interested in videogames, you should also consider getting an education in something to do with games.
Also, I recommend that you move out of your brother's basement and get a job that fully supports yourself. That way he has no right to complain about your life - after all, being able to support yourself without outside help is one of the most appreciated things in society.

Blackest Rose · Jul 25, 2007, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Wow - well since so many contributed their life stories on gaming here's mine.
And my take on the comment that we're all freaks wasting our lives.....

I'm 33 now and started gaming when I was 10 on a c64.
I have been gaming over 23 years.
I watch very little TV, love movies and am happily married (to a non-gaming wife)
I read a lot, play poker socially and feel I have a good life.

I didn't waste my life on games - I was lucky and always realised early on that school came first. I studied hard, got my degree and worked all the way up to where I am today, managing a sizable number of people and I feel I'm good at my job.

I play games now more than I ever have - I deserve it - I put in the work when I need to and relax with my gaming hobby when the time is right.
I have about 2000 hrs logged on GW so far.

In another generation or so gaming will become socially acceptable, average game player age is going up every year as the first video game generation grows up.
I know - I'm helping make this happen!

I'm fortunate because I have always had enough self control to determine when I need to do something else because it's more important.
But I'll be a gamer til I die.

Gaming still has a stigma attached to it as being childish and for children - over the next generation or two that will go and it will become "socially acceptable"
Anyone who looks at gaming in general and calls it childish or a waste doesn't know what they're talking about.

To me playing the guitar is a complete waste of time - why would I want to do that for? It's hard and there are musicians out there who do it better than me.
Does that mean it's a waste of time for everyone - absolutely not - whatever you enjoy and just make sure you make good life choices and you'll be alright....

Ork Pride · Jul 25, 2007, 08:43 PM // 20:43

Stop playing games you nerd.

Paloma Song · Jul 25, 2007, 09:14 PM // 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyche7

There are many advantages to playing video games you don't even think about but watching tv is completely passive.

Do people really do this? Sit on a couch and do nothing but watch TV? I'd go insane. Yes, in that case, gaming is obviously better. But who watches TV that mindlessly? I'm constantly analyzing it, thinking about what I see, talking it over with my husband, in addition to a million other things. Like you, we multi-task - gotta use time efficiently. Listen to music, websurf, watch tivo, play a game, talk, check email, eat, more stimuli PLEASE. I work out to movies and podcasts, he works out while websurfing (steps, bikes and treadmills are great for this). Life's too short to sit around doing just ONE thing at a time!

And it's definitely too short to let small-minded tech-ignorant people tell you how you ought to spend your free time.

Zorgy · Jul 25, 2007, 09:17 PM // 21:17

"...."Productivity" is overrated.

IMO, education is a huge waste of time. Much of what you are taught is completely irrelevant to what you want to do in life, much is just fluff extending the amount of time that you have to stay in school/university, and you will forget the vast majority of what you are taught. Yes, it helps you get a job and make you a more informed citizen (and feeds you nationalist propaganda), but what they need to teach you could be done in a much shorter time.

Working really hard to make a lot of money is also a waste of time. Beyond having enough money to get what you need, all that extra money doesn't make you any happier, even though that's exactly what people think it will do. I'd rather just spend my time doing something that makes me happy (playing a game) than work a lot of overtime trying to get something that I think will make me happy but really won't.

We are quite lucky to have this amount of free time in the first place. In the past, people would spend the whole day at work on farms or in factories, often in horrible conditions. They were productive. But I'd never want to trade places with them.

Life is short. Try to spend some of your time relaxing and having fun, not conforming to society's standards of what is considered fun or productive. People will say you're wasting your life by playing games instead of going out and getting drunk, because they're too narrow-minded to understand that what is fun for them may not be fun for others."

Andisa Kalorn, congrats

1000% ok with your post.....

"Ludwig Wittgenstein argued that language is a game consisting of tokens governed by rough-and-ready rules that arise by convention and are not strict.[1]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language-games

Dont worry, be happy & keep on gaming........

Edgar The Crosseyed · Jul 25, 2007, 09:20 PM // 21:20

I have my own set of rules about my gaming. Some days i have absolutely NO obligations, since im a Uni Student :P yeah im lazy.. So some people get bored and dont know what to do.. Well i will go play on my xbox with mates or play gw..

Other days im completely fully booked with Field hockey, watching movie with mates, go out to town and have a lot of alcohol and laughs, play golf or go on a day out.. or just hang out with friends.

so my rule is: If i have nothing to do i go and play gw or whatever.. As long as i NEVER cancel any social activities i would have done had i not known GW!
Dont let your rl suffer!!! rl>gw!!!!

Shuuda · Jul 25, 2007, 09:29 PM // 21:29

Quote:

who watches TV that mindlessly?

Homer Simpson. And the large group of American males his character represents.

KIDGOOCH · Jul 25, 2007, 09:47 PM // 21:47

This game, WoW, Second Life and all other "games" which don't have a definitive end, are life wasters. I play 15 - 20 hours a week and have since beta, with some weeks as much as 50 hours. I work a full time job, have a wife, kid and dog which all require attention. So how do I make time? I give up sleep for the game, I start playing after 11:00 pm and quit around 1:30 am to go to be and get up and do it again the next day, I haven't slept for more than 6 hours in one night in years. The game is an escape for me, the problems in life vanish when I log on (except a few nights ago when my dog went out and got hit by a skunk *STINKY*).

So as long as the player can put things in proper perspective, go for it, otherwise, go get a life, and come back later.

We'll be here!!!